The theme of sustainable development is now inevitable in developed countries. Civil society, the scientific community, industry and the political world have taken ownership of this fundamental issue. But few glances brought on developing countries. How is it that these statements tomorrow to be the biggest polluters of the planet are not further identified in the environmental debate? Thierry Wolton, historian and essayist answers our questions concerning the Chinese emblematic case. Author of numerous books, it is currently finalising his latest book (1) devoted to China. "The great Chinese bluff" to be published in April next year, a book critical analysis and without compromising on the country according led some to become the next world power. The environment has emerged as a major socio-economic challenges for the empire of the environment.



What is the energy problem of china?

It is above all a problem that lies in the path of development. The contradictions energy derived industrial choices. The china is in an industrial development, the high activity of the secondary sector involves a very large consumption of raw materials. If he continues with this rate of growth, there will not be enough resources. They decided to liquefy coal to make gasoline. Out of this technique appears to be doubly clean: it takes energy to extract the essence that once consumed gas emits pollutants. From a purely energy, not to mention the problem of the environment, "Chinese industrial revolution" can not hold long-term, and even a medium-term elsewhere.



Was he not alternative policies?

First the wind farm will never be an absolute solution. We know that wind power can meet only 10 or 15% of energy. Rest when nuclear energy. Even if it's a solution, then arises the problem of waste. The danger in the totalitarian countries like China is the management of this waste. There is see that the example of the Soviet Union: in Russia today, countless sites, including Murmansk or rotting old nuclear submarines, are highly contaminated, not even talking about the case… Chernobyl. .
The democratic countries themselves, arriving to find balanced solutions. I doubt that China is capable.



When you stand the mismatch between development and energy?

This will arise very quickly, within ten years. Although China has embarked on a race for resources in Africa, Azerbaijan, or in Russia, competition with Japan and the USA is very present. The government is acutely aware of this vulnerability, hence the development of alternative techniques (hydroelectric dams of the three gorges, coal liquefaction, etc.).



The china can overcome this contradiction between a boom and the lack of resources?

No, not short-term. The only solution is nuclear power, but this is part of a long cycle. The time that the country buys substantially in nuclear, the contradiction has already taken place. At one point there will be a bottleneck. By ten years after me.



What are the major environmental challenges?

Water: 70% of the water is no longer usable, ie to even the most reprocess, either for consumption or for agriculture. Two million hectares are irrigated with wastewater.

Waste management: 130,000 hectares are used for waste storage

In the end all of this has an impact on public health, lack of drinking water, air pollution, and so on.

For the anecdote, former Premier Jiang Zemin, when he was appointed a Shanghai said that he had just lost five years of his life expectancy. And not even talking about Beijing, which is even more polluted. And on this point, the organization of the Olympic Games in the city in 2008 seems to be complete nonsense. The tests will be difficult…



What is the price of this pollution?

According to the World Bank, pollution currently costs between 8 and 12% of GDP. China spends 1.5% of its GDP to the problem of pollution while it is estimated that affect 3%.



What are the sources of urban pollution?

Mainly Chinese industry, I do not speak of the industry settles Western there. The china is well below environmental standards in the West. You should know that China's industries operate like those of developed countries within 50 years, they use coal and are totally outdated. And the industry is very fragmented, it goes back to the communist paranoia. Since the scheme was afraid of being attacked, it has spread its industries throughout the territory which is not conducive to the rationalization of production especially in terms of transportation.



How to understand the attacks against the USA on these issues while China and other developing countries also greatly pollute?

It would like to anti-Americanism, anti-liberalism and anti-capitalism. But the USA is a democratic country, or there is a civil society, and where the place of the individual in society is important. All of this does not exist in China because it is a totalitarian country in which the leaders in power do not even consider these questions. Although the USA are behind on environmental issues with regard to Europe, they will eventually get there, they have already begun elsewhere. The posture of systematic denunciation will have to be reconsidered because in ten years, the Chinese will be the first polluters in the world.

Interviewed was transcribed by Olivier A,


(1) The Chinese Grand Bluff by Thierry Wolton, forthcoming end of April 2007 published by Robert Laffont